[Warning: Is 3 comments long]
[Tldr: I’m too experienced and jaded to be the industry’s target ez-prey dolla-dolla demographic, but trying to be hopeful]
[1 of 3]
It was first expansions that you could buy. Like add-ons to the game that added content. You’d buy them in a store and have to install them separately over/in the original game.
Then they were served over the internet and would just install themselves.
Then there were patches and stuff.
Then… Those started to sort of blur together. Different companies would give them to you for free, others would charge you for it. Most pc titles only charged you for the big additions, and PlayStation stuff was also largely free services. But Microsoft on xbox was like lolno u gota pay. And everybody followed suit.
And now you pay for the game, the expansion, skins, save slots, storage space for items, quality of life fixes, new audio, etc.
And now it is the sole purpose of the “game” studios, the worst thing to happen:
“Games As A Service”
You pay for everything and the game is designed around selling stuff. It’s not fun, it’s bad quality, it’s expensive, and it’s just the way things are now for everything except small foreign indie studios.
Specifically those things together. Small AND Foreign AND indie. I was looking at what games I actually liked playing in the past ten or so years, and almost every single one was a small studio, in Scandinavia or croatia or Asia, and was an independent studio. I was SHOCKED.
I get that games in the 80s and 90s (I’m only 33 but I know my history, I started gaming in the late 90s) used to cost 60-70$ and have gone DOWN in price despite massive and constant inflation. But instead of accounting for the real need for now cash to still develop games with the same scale, features, depth, and quality by just increasing the price, they’ve chosen to itemize the price behind the lie of a free trial of an intentionally limited and frustrating “game” full of mechanisms to coerce you to constantly spend money.
I’ve worked in construction, and this is the same unethical behavior a lot of contractors do. They start out with a low price, and “find” problems that you’re basically forced to do change orders on. It’s super predatory and deeply unethical, and the same thing that the game industry is ALL moving towards.
I really wish studios would just come out and say “this is how much the game costs us to build if you want lv 1 quality, this for lv 2, and this for lv 3. This is how much we forecast it will cost you players for each level.” And just try to gague interest and make the best possible game possible within some forecasts, with maybe ranges of price with the final price being different at the end. I know that’s probably too much to ask, but GaaS is soooo, so frustrating.
I love gaming. I played, in their eras, a lot of the greatest games of all time. And NONE of them felt like you were ripped off. Not even for the mediocre titles. And it feels like the scopes of games now are just taking a decent minigame from some masterpiece game of the past, adding in some extra features, polishing it up a bit, selling it at full price, then selling extra bits piecemeal to try to make even more money. Like, bro, that was a MINIgame in ff8! You didn’t even have to play it, it was just there if you needed a break from the rest of the game!
Also, I love great graphics. I love tech and think a lot of the technical progress we’ve made in the past decade has been really cool…
But I just don’t give a shit about any of it if the game sucks. The other day, my brother in law bought the group of us this weird Japanese game, made in 2019 but looked like it was made in 2001 called Earth Defense Force 5. It has some technical issues and honestly looks embarrassingly bad. But - it’s FUN! It’s a bit limited in scope for a full price game, but it’s ACTUALLY fun.
Contrary to that, we bought diablo4. I liked Diablo 3, especially after they added a ton of lategame stuff after the expansion, it is honestly a super good game. Diablo has always been a fairly small scope, somewhat casually playable party game - it has never been a long dramatic epic, that’s just not what it is, it’s a fun game that you play with your friends and grind out new gear. D3 was colorful, goofy, adventurous, and felt good (only after the expansion).
But d4… is both literally and metaphorically brown. It isn’t colorful, it’s built around a micro transaction shop and basically a quarterly subscription meant to draw you in and keep paying. There’s a reason I didn’t play world of warcraft - I thought it was overpriced and grindy, meant to slow your progress to make you play longer.
Compare that to guild wars… you buy the game… And that’s it. An mmo that you just play when you feel, no subscription. They sell expansions every few years and have a cash shop, but most of the things are silly skins or hats or musical instruments. You aren’t SUPPOSED to buy them all, they’re just there to further support the studio if you want. (There’s the bag limitations, but I forgive that for all the other positives).
Things have changed. I don’t buy AAA games basically ever since basically the ps2 era. I’m always watching and waiting though. I remain hopeful, watching dunkey and total biscuit before he died, and zero punctuation, and a few others. But, very few things made me want to buy them, and none have motivated me to do so on consoles. I think PC is superior in every way, but I love consoles and have been looking for an excuse to buy the new PlayStation now for a LONG time. The dualsense almost made me do it, but the games were just so MEHHHH and derivative, and I just bought the controller and use it on pc anyway. It’s a bit dumbly designed, and is somehow inferior to a lot of the previous controllers, I really think the ps2 was peak controllers minus the long throw L/R2 triggers. Did you know that the buttons on the PlayStations in that era were analog? The BUTTONS. It would know how hard you were pushing them and the GTAs of that era used them for throttle. They didn’t have to do that! But, xbox was all shitty stolen design and super cheap and nicked and dimed at every chance they could, even forcing developers that WANTED to give free content to sell it so as to not set a precedent (ex: valve l4d map packs).
So, to try to close this book of a post out, yes, there have been changes to what games I buy and play. I am a hell of a critic, a cynic, and am sad and depressed games are like this now. I’m aware of how it all happened, but I’m no happier for it. I miss super integrous critics that would outright fail games for good reasons and act constructively to everybody’s benefit, and how they were super influential and gamers world actually listen to them.
But now, instead of word of mouth “play this it’s fun”, or somebody showing me a game every few months and it looks awesome…
Instead of those ways, I hear that trailers for a game have come out, watch it, and I’m either immediately deflated and disappointed, I’ve got red flags shooting up that just end up being true, or I’m entirely not interested in another fad battle royale early access game.
Now, I do the thing for streaming series and movies:
Don’t buy into hype. Ever. Just don’t. Don’t play anything new. It’s all shitty and it’s always broken. And don’t play anything that doesn’t look and review and gameplay and has real, organic lasting feedback unless it’s a few years old and people are STILL playing it. It’s the “if it’s good, it’ll stick around” test. Let it get fixed. Let it get patched. Let the suckers waste their time. It’ll be around in the future no matter what. And if it’s good, it’ll still be good later. I know this isn’t the best for the studios, but they need to stop making fucking bad games with bad business models. I do absolutely buy full price games if i actually think they’re good. If you, publishers, want to milk all the suckers and people that can’t help themselves, I don’t like it but I can’t do anything about it, but you won’t see a cent from me. D4 being GaaS and ultra brown and me buying it was a calculated mistake. I was sure that Blizzard wouldn’t fuck it up, but they did. I’m also sure that they’ll fix it. So we’ll see.
To the person who initially posted this: I want to know how old you are, what your history and experience is in gaming, and why you even care or want to hear what bitter old gamers have to say. Assuming you’re gen z or alpha, or at least younger than me, the fact that you asked this leads me to believe you’ve either noticed the old gamers complaining ISN’T totally unsubstantiated, or are curious. Well, I’m curious, too. I want to know from the people that DO buy and HAVE BEEN buying AAA games, why you do that? I want to know if it’s just me, or what about me and my experience makes me not see these games as fun or valuable? Are they really as mindless as I’ve found on my own? Or is there something I’m missing in my bitterness? Do I know too much and have played too many good games? Or have I created masterpieces out of nostalgic memories? Why can’t I find newer games fun? Am I unable to be developed for? Or am I just not worth as much? What’s the deal? Where are the games I want to play?
There’s literally no WAY that I’m a small democratic of untapped low-prioritized gamers. Do people in my experience group just whine too much and expect too much? Because we’re probably very much willing to pay. If ff7 remake were actually good, released all at once, and was 500$ for the FULL game that succeeded the fun that we had while he playing the original, there would be obvious questions, but TONS of people would still buy it. Video cards in 2000 cost like 250$ high end, and ff7 was 50&, about 1/5th the price. High end videocards now are 2000 and 1/5th is about 400$, so not super far off, really. Sure, wages and cost of living are FUCKED up right now, but it’s the same for everybody, including developers. Just, you need more developers for longer, now, since it takes more people longer to do the same amount of playable content. It doesn’t HAVE to, but we all want fancy new graphics and mocap and studio recorded and mastered orchestra and shaders and complex sound programming and layered animations and all the other complexity it takes. Why not just pay more, all at once, and have games be ACTUALLY good?
Apparently because you make more money on addicting kids to micro transactions than you do being fucking responsible.
Once again, unethical business practices doing the same shit are to blame. And WHY do they do that? Because stockholders and corporations dictate maximization of profit and not what’s good for the workers or the consumers. It ALWAYS comes down to this. Always. And us old fucks know it and don’t support it and do our best to educate the ignorant. We say “don’t do that” and “that’s bad” and “it used to be better” and “go play this old game so that you’ll know better”. But unfortunately, graphics and dopamine farms far outweigh smelly old, paced games with some old technical flaws, and unless played fully, can’t even draw an audience when compared to the dopamine fix and the invigorating outrage and frustration you get from playing CoD16: Black Hawks 5 - BloodTide deathmatch in 8k HDR @120fps vsync on a 70 inch oled on the brand new console. So cooooooool~ “Hold up, just gotta buy my season pass, the dungeon key, renew my sub, buy this 40$ emote dance that’s super funny, and this skin. Yeaaah, 70$ for a Zelda game is a bit much for a game though, nobody’s gunna buy that…”
<---- translated to Nintendo-eese: “Hi, we either want more microtransactions instead of paying $10 more for the game, or we want the game to be a little shittier in every way… and ALSO microtransactions.”
[Warning: Is 3 comments long]
[Tldr: I’m too experienced and jaded to be the industry’s target ez-prey dolla-dolla demographic, but trying to be hopeful]
[1 of 3]
It was first expansions that you could buy. Like add-ons to the game that added content. You’d buy them in a store and have to install them separately over/in the original game.
Then they were served over the internet and would just install themselves.
Then there were patches and stuff.
Then… Those started to sort of blur together. Different companies would give them to you for free, others would charge you for it. Most pc titles only charged you for the big additions, and PlayStation stuff was also largely free services. But Microsoft on xbox was like lolno u gota pay. And everybody followed suit.
And now you pay for the game, the expansion, skins, save slots, storage space for items, quality of life fixes, new audio, etc.
And now it is the sole purpose of the “game” studios, the worst thing to happen:
“Games As A Service”
You pay for everything and the game is designed around selling stuff. It’s not fun, it’s bad quality, it’s expensive, and it’s just the way things are now for everything except small foreign indie studios.
Specifically those things together. Small AND Foreign AND indie. I was looking at what games I actually liked playing in the past ten or so years, and almost every single one was a small studio, in Scandinavia or croatia or Asia, and was an independent studio. I was SHOCKED.
I get that games in the 80s and 90s (I’m only 33 but I know my history, I started gaming in the late 90s) used to cost 60-70$ and have gone DOWN in price despite massive and constant inflation. But instead of accounting for the real need for now cash to still develop games with the same scale, features, depth, and quality by just increasing the price, they’ve chosen to itemize the price behind the lie of a free trial of an intentionally limited and frustrating “game” full of mechanisms to coerce you to constantly spend money.
I’ve worked in construction, and this is the same unethical behavior a lot of contractors do. They start out with a low price, and “find” problems that you’re basically forced to do change orders on. It’s super predatory and deeply unethical, and the same thing that the game industry is ALL moving towards.
I really wish studios would just come out and say “this is how much the game costs us to build if you want lv 1 quality, this for lv 2, and this for lv 3. This is how much we forecast it will cost you players for each level.” And just try to gague interest and make the best possible game possible within some forecasts, with maybe ranges of price with the final price being different at the end. I know that’s probably too much to ask, but GaaS is soooo, so frustrating.
I love gaming. I played, in their eras, a lot of the greatest games of all time. And NONE of them felt like you were ripped off. Not even for the mediocre titles. And it feels like the scopes of games now are just taking a decent minigame from some masterpiece game of the past, adding in some extra features, polishing it up a bit, selling it at full price, then selling extra bits piecemeal to try to make even more money. Like, bro, that was a MINIgame in ff8! You didn’t even have to play it, it was just there if you needed a break from the rest of the game!
[Continued in next reply]
[continued from previous comment]
[2 of 3]
Also, I love great graphics. I love tech and think a lot of the technical progress we’ve made in the past decade has been really cool…
But I just don’t give a shit about any of it if the game sucks. The other day, my brother in law bought the group of us this weird Japanese game, made in 2019 but looked like it was made in 2001 called Earth Defense Force 5. It has some technical issues and honestly looks embarrassingly bad. But - it’s FUN! It’s a bit limited in scope for a full price game, but it’s ACTUALLY fun.
Contrary to that, we bought diablo4. I liked Diablo 3, especially after they added a ton of lategame stuff after the expansion, it is honestly a super good game. Diablo has always been a fairly small scope, somewhat casually playable party game - it has never been a long dramatic epic, that’s just not what it is, it’s a fun game that you play with your friends and grind out new gear. D3 was colorful, goofy, adventurous, and felt good (only after the expansion).
But d4… is both literally and metaphorically brown. It isn’t colorful, it’s built around a micro transaction shop and basically a quarterly subscription meant to draw you in and keep paying. There’s a reason I didn’t play world of warcraft - I thought it was overpriced and grindy, meant to slow your progress to make you play longer.
Compare that to guild wars… you buy the game… And that’s it. An mmo that you just play when you feel, no subscription. They sell expansions every few years and have a cash shop, but most of the things are silly skins or hats or musical instruments. You aren’t SUPPOSED to buy them all, they’re just there to further support the studio if you want. (There’s the bag limitations, but I forgive that for all the other positives).
Things have changed. I don’t buy AAA games basically ever since basically the ps2 era. I’m always watching and waiting though. I remain hopeful, watching dunkey and total biscuit before he died, and zero punctuation, and a few others. But, very few things made me want to buy them, and none have motivated me to do so on consoles. I think PC is superior in every way, but I love consoles and have been looking for an excuse to buy the new PlayStation now for a LONG time. The dualsense almost made me do it, but the games were just so MEHHHH and derivative, and I just bought the controller and use it on pc anyway. It’s a bit dumbly designed, and is somehow inferior to a lot of the previous controllers, I really think the ps2 was peak controllers minus the long throw L/R2 triggers. Did you know that the buttons on the PlayStations in that era were analog? The BUTTONS. It would know how hard you were pushing them and the GTAs of that era used them for throttle. They didn’t have to do that! But, xbox was all shitty stolen design and super cheap and nicked and dimed at every chance they could, even forcing developers that WANTED to give free content to sell it so as to not set a precedent (ex: valve l4d map packs).
So, to try to close this book of a post out, yes, there have been changes to what games I buy and play. I am a hell of a critic, a cynic, and am sad and depressed games are like this now. I’m aware of how it all happened, but I’m no happier for it. I miss super integrous critics that would outright fail games for good reasons and act constructively to everybody’s benefit, and how they were super influential and gamers world actually listen to them.
But now, instead of word of mouth “play this it’s fun”, or somebody showing me a game every few months and it looks awesome…
Instead of those ways, I hear that trailers for a game have come out, watch it, and I’m either immediately deflated and disappointed, I’ve got red flags shooting up that just end up being true, or I’m entirely not interested in another fad battle royale early access game.
[Continued in next reply]
[continued from previous reply]
[3 of 3]
Now, I do the thing for streaming series and movies:
Don’t buy into hype. Ever. Just don’t. Don’t play anything new. It’s all shitty and it’s always broken. And don’t play anything that doesn’t look and review and gameplay and has real, organic lasting feedback unless it’s a few years old and people are STILL playing it. It’s the “if it’s good, it’ll stick around” test. Let it get fixed. Let it get patched. Let the suckers waste their time. It’ll be around in the future no matter what. And if it’s good, it’ll still be good later. I know this isn’t the best for the studios, but they need to stop making fucking bad games with bad business models. I do absolutely buy full price games if i actually think they’re good. If you, publishers, want to milk all the suckers and people that can’t help themselves, I don’t like it but I can’t do anything about it, but you won’t see a cent from me. D4 being GaaS and ultra brown and me buying it was a calculated mistake. I was sure that Blizzard wouldn’t fuck it up, but they did. I’m also sure that they’ll fix it. So we’ll see.
To the person who initially posted this: I want to know how old you are, what your history and experience is in gaming, and why you even care or want to hear what bitter old gamers have to say. Assuming you’re gen z or alpha, or at least younger than me, the fact that you asked this leads me to believe you’ve either noticed the old gamers complaining ISN’T totally unsubstantiated, or are curious. Well, I’m curious, too. I want to know from the people that DO buy and HAVE BEEN buying AAA games, why you do that? I want to know if it’s just me, or what about me and my experience makes me not see these games as fun or valuable? Are they really as mindless as I’ve found on my own? Or is there something I’m missing in my bitterness? Do I know too much and have played too many good games? Or have I created masterpieces out of nostalgic memories? Why can’t I find newer games fun? Am I unable to be developed for? Or am I just not worth as much? What’s the deal? Where are the games I want to play?
There’s literally no WAY that I’m a small democratic of untapped low-prioritized gamers. Do people in my experience group just whine too much and expect too much? Because we’re probably very much willing to pay. If ff7 remake were actually good, released all at once, and was 500$ for the FULL game that succeeded the fun that we had while he playing the original, there would be obvious questions, but TONS of people would still buy it. Video cards in 2000 cost like 250$ high end, and ff7 was 50&, about 1/5th the price. High end videocards now are 2000 and 1/5th is about 400$, so not super far off, really. Sure, wages and cost of living are FUCKED up right now, but it’s the same for everybody, including developers. Just, you need more developers for longer, now, since it takes more people longer to do the same amount of playable content. It doesn’t HAVE to, but we all want fancy new graphics and mocap and studio recorded and mastered orchestra and shaders and complex sound programming and layered animations and all the other complexity it takes. Why not just pay more, all at once, and have games be ACTUALLY good?
Apparently because you make more money on addicting kids to micro transactions than you do being fucking responsible.
Once again, unethical business practices doing the same shit are to blame. And WHY do they do that? Because stockholders and corporations dictate maximization of profit and not what’s good for the workers or the consumers. It ALWAYS comes down to this. Always. And us old fucks know it and don’t support it and do our best to educate the ignorant. We say “don’t do that” and “that’s bad” and “it used to be better” and “go play this old game so that you’ll know better”. But unfortunately, graphics and dopamine farms far outweigh smelly old, paced games with some old technical flaws, and unless played fully, can’t even draw an audience when compared to the dopamine fix and the invigorating outrage and frustration you get from playing CoD16: Black Hawks 5 - BloodTide deathmatch in 8k HDR @120fps vsync on a 70 inch oled on the brand new console. So cooooooool~ “Hold up, just gotta buy my season pass, the dungeon key, renew my sub, buy this 40$ emote dance that’s super funny, and this skin. Yeaaah, 70$ for a Zelda game is a bit much for a game though, nobody’s gunna buy that…”
<---- translated to Nintendo-eese: “Hi, we either want more microtransactions instead of paying $10 more for the game, or we want the game to be a little shittier in every way… and ALSO microtransactions.”